Yes We Can ... Talk About the Obama Issue!
"Gang War"! Huh! What is it good for?
Hi, we are Dapper Dan Gvozden and Mischievous Mark Ginocchio, co-hosts of the Amazing Spider-Talk podcast. With each newsletter we hope to give you greater access into our thoughts on the world of Spider-Man!
On the latest Amazing Spider-Talk Podcast we just wrapped Season 6 and are reviewing the latest Spidey comics, but in this Substack we will be reviewing all the latest “Gang War” and other B-titles and recounting our memories of the infamous “Obama issue” of Amazing Spider-Man. But first, please subscribe to our Substack!
And, if you want to help support what we do, plus get bonus episodes of the Amazing Spider-Talk, digital artwork, prints in the mail, and early access to every episode of the show, please check out our Patreon. Putting this together takes a lot of time, energy, and funds, so we would be hugely appreciative of your support.
We’ve got a review of Amazing Spider-Man (vol. 6) #42 already on the platform for you to watch/listen to!
Now, let’s get to our remembrances of the “Obama” issue and reviews of all the various Spider-Man B-Titles!
Mark’s Comic Book Meditations
When Mark launched Chasing Amazing in 2010, the blog chronicled his “quest” to collect every issue of Amazing Spider-Man and featured a series of posts that recalled memories and meditations around specific comics he came to own. As part of this newsletter, we’re resurrecting these remembrances with some new wrinkles, and will also occasionally chronicle some other comics Mark has purchased since completing his ASM run in 2014.
Amazing Spider-Man #583
Mark: The world of Spider-Man comics is filled with a small handful of issues where just a simple phrase can conjure a strong reaction or memory. In the case of Amazing Spider-Man #583 — it is known simply as the “Obama issue.”
Actually, the “A” story in the comic is a sweet little romp about Peter planning a birthday party for Betty Brant. When no one shows up for it, Betty (and the reader) immediately think Peter is pulling a Peter again, when in fact, he did his very best to get the crew together, but no one wanted to show up for Betty’s birthday.
In our Amazing Spider-Talk review of ASM (vol. 6) #31 last year, Dapper Dan pointed out that the storyline with Peter planning Randy’s bachelor party ripped off the “Obama issue” nearly beat for beat. And I got to be honest … despite how right Dan was, I didn’t remember because what I remember about the “Obama issue” was of course, the Obama story.
It’s been 15 years since this comic came out, but it honestly feels like a lifetime ago. Not because “time flies” or anything like that, but because our political discourse has changed so radically since Obama was elected that I can not possibly imagine a major publisher like Marvel platforming a story about a U.S. President any more out of fear of a volatile reaction from whoever the “opposing side” may be. This is not me trying to “both sides” politics here — I have my opinions and I’m sure many of you who have been following me for years have a sense of where my politics lie. However, I think it’s telling that within two years of the “Obama issue” you had political pundits ranting about Obama “brainwashing” the country because Marvel had the audacity to create a new mixed-race Spider-Man named Miles Morales (though you can draw a direct connection between Obama’s Presidency and the creation of Miles). In short, there’s no way a mainstream comic book could put forward an earnest superhero story around a figure like Obama, Joe Biden, Donald Trump, Ron Desantis, or whoever, in 2024.
Still, despite these cold hard facts, it’s still not hard for me to look back at a comic like this and not feel the pangs of nostalgia. Not for a sunnier political time, but for the fact that the simple addition of a silly backup story starring the incoming President of the United States being impersonated by one of Spider-Man’s rogues, the Chameleon, could be the phenomenon that it ended up being. When our pod had former Marvel editor Tom Brennan on the show a few years back, Tom discussed how many careers at Marvel were made by the “Obama issue.’ And rightly so. The comic was a juggernaut. I don’t know if we’ll ever see a Spider-Man comic be such an integral part of the pop culture zeitgeist again.
Meanwhile, in terms of how I went about acquiring this comic, the story behind it isn’t much of a story at all. When I became a home subscriber to Amazing Spider-Man in the mid-2000s, one of the primary reasons I subscribed was because I wanted the guarantee that every issue would be delivered to my home, no fuss no muss (granted, the same could have been accomplished with a pull list at a local comic book shop, but at the time, I really didn’t have that option). So while the comic probably came a week or two late, it just showed up on my doorstep one day. I opened up the envelope, gave it a read, chuckled at the Obama story, and slipped the comic into a bag and board.
One last semi-interesting fact. My home subscriber copy actually has the non-Obama cover by John Romita. But a few years later, I finally got around to purchasing an Obama cover several years later — a 4th printing. I guess one of these days, I need to go back and get one of the original Obama variants to fully “complete” my collection.
Dan: Mark, I feel compelled to weigh-in on this issue and the details around its release as well, so I hope you pardon my intrusion into your meditations. Believe me, the last thing anyone wants to see when they are meditating is Dan Gvozden entering the room. But, I have really strong memories surrounding the release of this comic that I hoped to share.
I’ll go a step further into revealing my politics for this post, because they made this issue all the more special for me. Starting in 2007, I was a volunteer for the Obama campaign’s early work in the primary against Hillary Clinton. At the time, I don’t think anyone knew quite how long the primary would go, much less that it could put Obama in the position to win the 2008 election. I was so moved by his speech at the 2004 Democratic National Convention that I became an early contributor to his various campaigns for public office. The assertion that we were one nation, not Democrat or Republican, was such a healing notion and speech to me, someone deeply enraged by what I thought was a Bush administration that only sought to serve and pander to Republicans, that it brought me into volunteering for politicians for the first time.
I spent much of my free time and weekends, in my final years of college, on buses out of New York City to canvas for Barack Obama, especially to Pennsylvania in the final months of the campaign for President. I’ll never forget spending election day helping people to the polls in rural Pennsylvania, a hotly contested state at the time, and then celebrating his victory in a New York City Mexican restaurant, gulping down margaritas, as the chanted name “OBAMA” echoed down the avenues of Manhattan. I don’t think I’ve ever felt more involved in politics and more optimistic about my role in democracy as I did in those moments.
So, seeing the politician that I felt I helped get into office, who also happened to be the first black man to become President, on the cover of an Amazing Spider-Man comic was deeply moving to me. Like Mark, I don’t know how I’d feel about this being replicated for more modern Presidents, but the historic nature of Obama’s Presidency, as well as his own noted fandom of Spider-Man, made this one seem appropriate and special. Clearly, I wasn’t alone, as it went on to sell at least five times more than a typical issue of Amazing Spider-Man.
As to how I picked it up, I actually only acquired the first printing of this comic’s iconic variant cover a few years ago. At the time, I was working at Midtown Comics in Times Square and had the opportunity to pick up a copy of the book from work. However, I was also subscribed to The Amazing Spider-Man, like Mark, thanks to a generous Christmas gift from a relative. At the time, I had no idea that the Obama cover was an alternate variant. I was a college student in New York City and low on funds, so I figured that the Obama cover would come in the mail and didn’t feel the pressure to pick it up straight away. By the time my day at work ended, I watched the lines form and all the issues sell out, it was unlike anything I had ever seen. It was then that my coworker informed me that the Obama cover wasn’t the primary cover to the issue. I freaked out.
We were sold out so I quickly raced out of work when my shift was over and down to my friends at Forbidden Planet, another comic shop off of Union Square in Manhattan. By the time I arrived the line was down the block and curving onto 4th Avenue. I hopped into line, hoping against hope that I might get a copy of the comic. Nearly half an hour later I reached the front of the line where I came to realize that I had only just missed the cutoff. They offered me a comic with the John Romita Sr. cover and… I bought one. At that point, I wasn’t going to wait for my copy to come in the mail. I put my name on a list, in case they were able to get me another copy, and left the store.
On the train-ride home I read the book cover to cover and thankfully it was an excellent issue of Amazing Spider-Man. I don’t quite know what to make of the backup Obama story, it was a bit anticlimactic after all that time, mostly a cameo story with some light Spidey shenanigans. Though, in hindsight, making the villain the Chameleon, a character whose shapeshifting face is entirely white, seems like a brilliant decision. I hadn’t secured a copy of the Obama issue, though I would get a 2nd printing of it shortly later, but I kind of blame this event for my instinctual purchasing instincts all these years later. This felt like a genuine event that I missed out on and I told myself that I wouldn’t be caught out of the loop on something like this ever again. Now that I own a 1st printing with the Obama cover, two with the John Romita Sr. cover (including the one that eventually arrived in the mail), and a 2nd printing, I feel like I have somehow fulfilled my obligation as a fan of both Obama and Spidey.
Additional note: Mark points out that I mentioned that Zeb Wells’ recent Amazing Spider-Man (vol. 6) #31 ripped off the primary story in Amazing Spider-Man #583, written by Mark Waid. Well, I thought it additionally important to note that Wells wrote the Obama story in the backup of that same issue. So, really, there is no way that he didn’t know about the Betty Brant story that he essentially reused, beat for beat, in that more modern issue. I like both stories, but… come on!
Swarm’s B(ee)-Title Reviews
With every new edition of the Amazing Spider-Talk Substack, Dan and Mark will venture to write short reviews of all the various Spider-Man books (and major Marvel releases) that have released since the previous newsletter. Sometimes our arch-villain Swarm might chime in as well. So “bee” prepared!
Dan: Mark has had a busy week, so I’m taking over the reviews this time! I hope you enjoy my take on the past two weeks of comics. Too bad there were no Annuals this time!
Miles Morales: Spider-Man (vol. 2) #15
In some ways, I think the Miles Morales: Spider-Man title is handling “Gang War” the best out of all the titles, while still not really feeling like a true elevation beyond a typical arc of the title. That’s both a plaudit and critique, as I think the story that we are getting is a fairly standard superhero brawl-fest, but also one that seamlessly flows out of what writer Cody Ziglar had been doing with the character and his world prior to the breakout of this war. By this particular chapter, nearly all of the characters who have been stalwarts of this run have joined the fray, plus a few more, and there’s still some time for forward momentum on Miles’ evolution as a character: specifically his place as a leader of heroes. The expansive cast makes this feel like a huge story, I just wish they were involved in doing something more dramatically interesting than fighting waves of enemies.
I have been a huge fan of Federico Vicentini, enough to commission artwork from him, but I think it is time that we all admit that the style can be particularly indiscernible at times. There are several panels and sequences in this book that are damn near impossible to interpret, enough that in our Slack we’ve been sharing images with diagrams breaking down our guesses at what we are looking at. There are stylistic artists, like Vicentini and Chris Bachalo, who need a strong-handed editor to help them balance their style and how it fits with both the script and colorist to best help the audience with what can be fairly abstract layouts and visuals. I feel like Vicentini has gotten looser in recent comics and as a result I find it increasingly difficult to make out what is happening. In that regard, this comic is a standout as probably the hardest I’ve worked to follow his action on the page. His work presents a still welcomed trade-off, for what we lose in clarity often is made up for by some stunning splashes and exciting energy. I just don’t think this issue highlights his strengths as much as his weaknesses.
Daredevil: Gang War #2
This tie-in is about as standard as they come. Fairly attractive art, well-staged action, a subplot that establishes how Madame Masque is slowly taking over New York City, and decent narration from our protagonist. It checks all the boxes and very little more. I can’t say that any one moment of it is seared in my memory, other than whatever amount of suspense and curiosity that finding out that the mysterious female assassin that Electra is up against has Wolverine’s claws. I’m sure we will find out who this person is eventually, and now that we know that Madame Masque has mind-control powers it could be literally anyone, and I will probably shrug. For me, the end of the issue says it all. Madame Masque assigns this assassin to “kill the She-Devil”. And, like, wasn’t that what was already happening? Time marches on, more fisticuffs will be exchanged, this is pretty standard, forgettable, inoffensive, superhero stuff.
Giant-Size Spider-Man (vol. 3) #1
Calling back to the old days of Giant-Size comics, for their 50th anniversary, I think it is important for readers to know that this issue includes a 30-page new Miles Morales story with a reprint of Ultimate Comics: Spider-Man #22. Both stories feature a fight between Miles and the Venom symbiote of their respective universes, with the reprint telling the story of Miles’ mother’s death at his hands. That older story was perfectly fine back when it was first released in 2013, but I distinctly remember being disappointed in the hollowness of its reveal of who was inside the Venom symbiote: “a nobody,” to borrow from Ditko’s playbook. Still, Pichelli’s unique rendering of the Venom symbiote deserves to be seen if readers didn’t pick it up a decade ago.
The primary tale features Miles tracking down Rabble weaponry from a new gang leader called Black Obsidian when his confrontation is interrupted by Dylan Brock in the Venom symbiote. The tale features a fun voice for Miles, congruent with Cody Ziglar’s work in his proper comic run, but also features an utterly baffling interpretation of modern Venom. The incongruities start when Venom triggers Miles’ spider-sense when bursting through a wall. I don’t know about you, but it is my understanding that the Venom symbiote famously doesn’t trigger the spider-sense of our heroes. He also acts like he’s never met Miles before, despite doing so many times throughout the Donny Cates and Ryan Stegman run of comics, just a few years ago. Also, Venom is presented as a rage-monster, out of control of Dylan Brock. Look, I get that the current Venom run is very confusing, but I don’t remember that being Dylan’s relationship with the symbiote either.
The only redeeming value here is the artist Iban Coello’s lithe interpretations of Spider-Man and Venom are utterly gorgeous to look at. Iban has been on and off the Spider-Man titles over the years, but his work here screams, “Give me another chance!” His page layouts a clean and uncluttered, despite the frenzy of the action. The characters are distinct, their fighting poses are dynamic and larger than life, and his manga-influence gives the action momentum and a silliness that is just plain fun.
Luke Cage: Gang War #3
I thought this series started incredibly strong and used the events of “Gang War” to properly test Luke Cage and how he would balance his role as mayor against the practical needs of his city. The first issue was a bit of a potboiler, governmental drama that established that Luke would need to play both politician and vigilante, enough that Luke established an alternate costume and personality to hide behind.
By this issue, both of those things are gone, as is the grounded tone of this book. I mean that actually quite literally. In this issue Luke is fighting towering spider-slayers, leaping stories into the air to punch them in the face, with very little concern for hiding his public persona to save his role as mayor. This change in tone has evaporated all of my interest in this particular series, as it devolves to into a pretty standard might-makes-right superhero story with zero of the nuance suggested by the primary issue. Bummer.
Spider-Gwen: SMASH #2
With the news that this story will be Spider-Gwen’s last in her universe, as she’s set to join the 616, it is fitting that Flores’ tale starts to build a justification for that change. Here, Gwen’s world comes “smashing” down as her band continues to fall apart and she feels less and less at-home in her universe. It’s a shame then, in the wake of the recent announcement, that this book and its cast are so much fun, if only because it highlights what makes this world so special. Putting The Mary Janes on tour with Dazzler and continuing to expand the cast of Earth-65, with an artist as fun and weird as Enid Balám has been a blast. How is it that the best post-Latour/Rodriguez Spider-Gwen comic is also the last in her actual universe?
Even more of a shame, Melissa Flores has such a grasp on this character and her world, and yet isn’t taking over the title when it relaunches in the 616. That’s not to knock Stephanie Phillips, who will be taking over and has written some fun comics elsewhere in the Marvel and DC universes, but man… a book this fun shouldn’t be the end of Earth-65 or Melissa Flores’ time with the character. If you’ve stayed away from Gwen after co-creators Jason Latour and Robbi Rodriguez ended their run, or if any of the many toothless mini-series between then and now pushed you away, this is the Gwen comic that you’ve probably been waiting for.
I mean, it features a several page poop/fart joke with Betty Brant. Nuff said.
Miguel O’Hara: Spider-Man 2099 #2
Steve Orlando’s exploration and rebuilding of the world of 2099 continues unabated in Miguel O’Hara: Spider-Man 2099 #2. This time he’s joined by artist Michael Dowling whose work on Hollow’s Eve made him the perfect fit for a Miguel vs. Dracula story. Even better, this particular tale is set in the crypt of Moon Knight 2099, on the moon!
Yes, this is an issue that starts with Spider-Man 2099 building a new space suit for himself (cool!), loading himself into a giant gun made by Black Widow (cooler!), and blasting himself at an Egyptian crypt on the moon (coolest!). What can I say? Two issues in and Orlando’s team-up mini-series remains one of the most exciting Spider-Man books on the market and the best thing done with 2099 since its inception.
Orlando just has such a knack for world-building that draws you right into the conflict and era almost effortlessly, whether or not you are new to this universe. Here, the downfall of the vampires and Dracula’s plight of revenge against genocide is compelling, quickly conveyed, and dreamed up beautifully. The following fight between Dracula and Miguel isn’t anything novel to superhero comics, but the implications on both the past and future of Vampyrsk conjure the imagination in ways that I hope to see play out in what is, hopefully, an inevitable full Spider-Man 2099 run from Orlando.
Tune in for our next Substack where we will be discussing Jackpot #1!
Audience Comments/Questions Answered
With every new edition of the Amazing Spider-Talk Substack, Mark and Dan will answer your submitted questions about any topic that you might be interested in. They will prioritize submissions from the Amazing Spider-Talk Patreon (sign up), but lacking any queries there they will respond to questions asked in the comments below. To get your question potentially picked, the Patreon is the best way to submit them.
Alright, let’s dive into the mailbag and answer some of the questions posed to us from Patreon!
Tashmon Dimps
Hey guys! Long-time listener, second time Substack questioner… What do you guys think was the Amazing Spider-Man comic’s BEST decade? I’ve been reading a lot of 70’s Spider-Man and really enjoying the tone and characterization of that era. I’m curious to hear what y’all think!
Mark: I think for historic purposes it’s hard to ignore the 1960s, but from a sheer personal preference standpoint, Amazing Spider-Man and Spider-Man comics overall reached their peak in the 1980s. After a shaky start with industry legend Denny O’Neil, arguably the greatest run since Stan Lee/Steve Ditko kicked off in 1983 with Roger Stern on scripts and John Romita Jr. on pencils. From there, we got one of the most beloved runs with Tom DeFalco and Ron Frenz. The decade ended with what is arguably the most popular run of all-time with David Michelinie and Todd McFarlane. Meanwhile, the stories themselves include classics like “Nothing Can Stop the Juggernaut,” “The Kid Who Collects Spider-Man,” “Kraven’s Last Hunt,” and “The Death of Jean DeWolff” with the creation of such iconics characters as the Alien Symbiote, Hobgoblin and Venom. The Spider-Man universe expanded with the launch of new titles like Web of, while Spectacular took on a new verve and voice. There was really no better time as a fan.
Dan: Call me simple, but for me the ‘60s are probably pound for pound the best decade of Spider-Man comics. There is a purity to those issues and a freewheeling feeling of invention that truly sets them aside. Stan Lee’s voice for the characters remains iconic and the artwork from Steve Ditko and John Romita Sr. cannot be surpassed. Now, inherently, there are less comics to read given that there was a single, monthly title, but if you want an era of just the classics you can’t go wrong. As much as I love the ‘80s and the ‘00s, I do think the quality is a bit watered down across the various titles. Whereas the ‘60s is just hit after hit after hit, with Peter at the center of it all.
Jonathan Creasman
While not common, real life celebrities have made appearances or teamed up with different Marvel heroes in the past. With the anniversary of the "Obama issue" I was curious which celebrity or politician would you like to see team up with the webslinger and why would they be a good fit?
Mark: While from a cultural standpoint, I have always been fascinated by comic book stories like Spider-Man teaming up with the cast from Saturday Night Live, or the Avengers appearing on The David Letterman Show, from a storytelling standpoint, I have long found these comics difficult to digest. These stories tend to get too meta and blur the lines of fantasy and reality in a way that I think leads to poor storytelling so rather than pitch a new celebrity guest appearance, I would rather keep these things separate.
Dan: I don’t tend to love celebrity cameo appearances in Spider-Man comics (even the Obama story is less fun than the novelty of the cover), but for the sake of the question I’m going to have a bit of fun with this request. In my mind, there is no other choice than Fran Lebowitz, who you may have seen in Martin Scorsese’s Netflix series Pretend It’s a City. Fran is a historic New York columnist who is a professional at comedically tearing apart the city in a way that underlines how much every New Yorker loves to hate it. I think she’d be a great comedic foil to the webslinger, but the catch is that she’d have to write all of her own dialogue. I don’t know many other comedians that could capture her unique voice.
She would also be a delightful counter to Spidey’s less self-deprecating humor. Spidey tends to wield wit, Fran offers biting social commentary in a miserly fashion. As a prominent member of the feminist movement and very outspoken on such topics, I think it’d be hilarious for her to meet all the various women in Spider-Man’s life and offer a frank critique of how they’ve been depicted over the years. And, maybe Scorsese can come along for the ride too!
What’s New for the Amazing Spider-Talk?
Since the previous Amazing Spider-Talk Substack we’ve seen the release of our tenth and final episode of Season 6 of the podcast. This time we discussed the original “Gang War” story from the ‘80s. This single story ended the Tom DeFalco and Ron Frenz run and likely spelled the end of Jim Owsley and Jim Shooter’s editorial reign.
Also… DAREDEVIL IN A FAT SUIT! (Thanks to artist Nick Cagnetti for the awesome cover artwork!)
We also released our review of Amazing Spider-Man (vol. 6) #38, the middle chapter of the latest Rek-Rap epic, which debuted on Patreon a couple of months ago.
We hope you enjoyed this tenth edition of the Amazing Spider-Talk Substack and that you’ll consider subscribing for our future newsletters.
And, if you haven’t already, please subscribe to our various podcasts, comment below, and consider joining our Patreon:
Hope Mark's doing ok! Also Dan, no Instagram post for this newsletter yet? I wanna help share it in my stories 🤪 Anyway, still a fan of this format!